SM/Cabby Nerf
Can we get some insight from anyone @Broadsword to shed light as to why the Spiritmasters Spec Lifetap is being nerfed, but the Cabalist's isnt?
The SM needs to spec higher, therefore the delve should be higher, currently the Cabalist can save nearly 150 points and actually have a higher delving lifetap. I understand the intercept nerf, but why can't the lifetaps stay the same? Or atleast level the playing field, and nerf Cabalist as well?
The SM needs to spec higher, therefore the delve should be higher, currently the Cabalist can save nearly 150 points and actually have a higher delving lifetap. I understand the intercept nerf, but why can't the lifetaps stay the same? Or atleast level the playing field, and nerf Cabalist as well?
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"The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
"Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
There does -- but I wouldn't hold yer breath....
Heretic, BD, Animist
Mauler
My guess is that Friars are a **** class for ST, and because Mid already has an AE stun you don't need to spend any points on.
Heretic, BD, Animist
Mauler
Symfriar (Friar duh)
Symsorc (Double duh)
Sympets (Theurg)
Symmond (Arms)
Some random mids and hibs
Opinions vary, the question is why nerf NOW -- rationale -- not what is your opinion of a spec
[edited] AE stun is not free.
https://forum.darkageofcamelot.com/discussion/1420/pendragon-patch-1-125a/p2
I've got no comments on it from @Broadsword since.
Don't get me wrong, If a nerf happens, it happens, worst case scenario I respec my SM, or play my other toons and abandon it, if I really don't like it after whatever happens to a nerfed toon (this goes not just for SM).
I've also suggested @Carol_Broadsword to simply detail the background of ANY balance changes now, or in the future, so the playerbase don't have to guess the reasons behind them, but could argue/accept it based on their viewpoint. At this point I am already happy if we get any sight on whats need to be changed by their opinion, and why. They surely have a reason behind any buff/nerf, I just miss sharing their visions with the community in balancing of the game, yet every other change they communicate pretty well actually.
I have to agree that its quite disturbing that no responses are made towards to player base (the ones who are paying the bills) I feel like the changes are derived from some salty players who happen to have their hand in the cookie jar, and simply want to see the change out of hopes in personal gain.
Would be really nice to get some sort of developer to elaborate on some changes that simply do not make sense, or qualify as "balancing" or "fixing"..
I still think an answer to this would be lovely.
I might be wrong about the disease and nearsight part being stronger, i personally just prefer it to what a dark SM gets.
I can vouche for the nearsight plus disease combo being very strong. Plus being able to sick a ML9 fully buffed pet that can't be rooted/mezzed on someome is nice too. I may be guilty of getting kills that way without having to cast.
"The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
"Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
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What I would like to see on an unrelated note is another class in Mid that can disease one is not enough Imo.
Any class should work like that. I realize its not apples to apples, but if you're going to nerf a specific class, then i will agree with other comments @Gavner . Give reasoning behind it.
The question ive seen asked is why for one and not the other. To get the 90% delve on SM you have to spec 47 into Dark (1127 points) - current 199 delve to be reduced.. but not reduce the amount of spec points required
To get the 90% delve on caby is spec 45 into body (1034 points) - current 199 delve, not being reduced.
Maybe it has more to do with the pets and their abilities? SM/Cabby comparison pet wise is resulting in the 199 delve reduction? Purely speculation on my end, an analyses from the devs would clear it up.
I suppose try sending the question in as a grab bag question as well, they might take the opportunity to answer it there.
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I think t6ons of things haven't been balanced and remain un-nerfed, the question is why this now...
Other than Sm warrior pet intercepting, which SM pets have always done <perhaps the rate is higher, seems so a bit, not a tone>, the pets are pretty useless
I do not play either class, but I have ran into both solo and I dont even touch SM’s, where as a cab? Easy rps.
GL
Sm pet mez reduction reduced ... pet nerf
sm pet side stun duration reduced... pet nerf
Both the caby and sm pets took a swingspeed nerf so thats a push.
Caby jade pet buff - rear style chain that melee dehaste and follow up stun
The level 47 sm delve took @ a 9% nerf on their lifetap, and again, i point out, the spec is higher than the caby's. saying it over and over again trying to understand their reasoning won't help i know. There are those who point out that sm/dark over caby/body is hard to compare. Thats why i believe you have to spec almost 90+ more spec points into dark to achieve the same amount of return (well.. before the patch that is... after, you will spec 90+ more spec points in dark to receive 9% less LT return comparatively)
@Amp_Phetamine I may take your advice and ask in the grab bag to hopefully get a response.
We can't do apples to apples. But we can get close. Let me give a scenario. My hunter and your scout. I want to spec my hunter 50 bc. You want to spec your scout 50 shield. Differences there, as there should be. But archery.. if i choose to spec 50 bc and to get the last powershot, i take archery to 45. Lets say you did go shield 50 but your archery needed 47 to get the last powershot, then your powershot damage was nerfed 9%, you'd ask why. Thats all i'm doing..
Not trying to derail the topic. I think the discussion is productive. I was merely giving an example
Having played a SM in pre-lab days I can tell you if you left your pet on passive, it would intercept at a 90% rate, and after the ML9 nerf there was next to zero point to the pet other then sm rr5 for the heal
Play some SM, it's aint 90%, and it got a nerf to 60% already which no one complained about as its reasonable.
Let's be real, Warrior pet is a tank pet with high health, and intercept. It's used for that, even ML9 dmg is like 50-90 buff botted, and melee dps pet, well dies in a second. I would actually enjoy trading intercept to snare, its far greater to kite then stand in one place hoping for intercept, I wouldn't mind a redesign completely on the tank pet.
Lifetap itself was always hell powerful ability to MoC with, and some ppl love to RA dump. Maybe the 90% return on spec and 60% on base both too much? Then nerf accordingly, nerfing the damage on one class is lazy, and solves 1% of the problem to create another.
No, now intercept is no longer 90%, but it used to be, so its already been nerfed.
Should be currently 75% to be nerfed to 60% following 1.125
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You’ve got a lot of paying customers here who are very interested in a response on the subject at hand. Why isn’t anything even being acknowledged that something is even being reconsidered or modified?
Can we get some developer insight? I’m sure it’ll help with this discussion.
How do you save 150 points from 45 to 47? Looks like 93 points to me. And lets face it you want the 25 skill con/str in spirit. Then with high rr you can go for red spirit debuff and use the spirit baseline - so 46 skill darkness is a must have anyway. In the end the difference is 28 spirit vs 26 spirit but you also need MoF2 to cap out the lifetap. Honestly minimal difference. Not sure what to think about the damage nerf ...
I have not geared out my SM enough to comment on their solo ability; however, I have had the most success soloing on my Cabalist than my other Alb casters (Wizard and Sorc).
"The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
"Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
Currently, my CV SM is temp'd, and he runs PD 7 and a little bit of Aug Dex.. Obviously not 4L9 capped. However, I, on numerous occasions have solo'd 2-3 melee classes with ease. Whether or not I land a mezz is a bonus.
I am not denying that the intercept ability needs some toning down, however, the spec lifetap should stay where its at. We spend the extra points for the higher spec, it needs to be recognized. If anything at all, Cabalist is the one that needs the nerf with having a higher delve, at a lower spec point.
I imagine you would have a difficult time reproducing that scenario at 50. There is such a large disparity between Cathal and NF that I wouldn't compare them.
"The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
"Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
That was another aspect to the confusion as to why the nerf is happening. There cant be that many BG crybabies to make a difference in an entire class. There are an endless amount of toys in NF to counter-act the intercept, and/or the high delving lifetap. @Broadsword is talking like the SM is some sort of God among casters.
Shaman gets high level, 400 radius AOE disease for free, and Nearsight is in the Matter spec. A Body/Matter cab cannot debuff for other casters, you'd need a second Cab in Spirit for that.
Heretic, BD, Animist
Mauler
The lifetap went from being the highest practical spellcaster DPS to being on par with a 205/2.8 in DPS, before the 9% lifetap bonus damage. I'd agree that there needs to be some more consistency for the same spells across realms though. Body Cabs could also take a hit if they got a minor buff to the spec to make up for it.
Heretic, BD, Animist
Mauler
Cleric gets stun for free....whats that gotta do with anything ?...............
Spirit caba can debuff their own FREE baseline LT and get NS + disease, again dont see what that got to do with a spec nuke.
If SM pet intercept is the problem then nerf that, why balance a spec nuke around it maybe being too strong with 1 out of 5 posible pets ?
If the health return is the problem then nerf that, why nerf the damage potential of a spec nuke that other classes have the same of ?
Whats next ? we nerf the dmg of the PBAE cause 1 out of 5 pets can intercept ?
Im sure, pretty much all can agree on that atm intercept + LT can be silly, but that to me atleast dosnt justify making equally silly nerfs.
Why does caba as the only one of the 3 original pet classes suddenly get taunt returned to a pet ? all 3 classes used to have taunt that got removed for some odd reason, but now caba needs it but the others dosnt ?
Im sorry but to me this just looks like random buffing and nerfing with not much thought behind it.
It exactly is...
The Cab pet can taunt, yes, but no Cab pet intercepts. The pets are all different.
And the Cleric getting stun for free is irrelevant, Alb and Mid only have one AOE disease class and the Shaman gets that for free. Saying Cabs get DZ in Body is not much of a credit for the Body Spec. Darkness is much better.
Heretic, BD, Animist
Mauler