BS putting the savage climb walls on 50 savagery based on a false premise

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Comments

  • edited November 2018 PM
    @BurkleyRIP - We have been over this before. Just becuase one realm has something doesn't mean all 3 should have it the same way. DAoC doesn't mirror classes. All realms are unique. Saying vamps don't have to spec for it, and minstrils don't have to sacrifice as much to get it is not a defense. When you go down that road it's a slippery slope. When do hibs/albs get aoe stun? When do albs and mids get insta amnesia? When do mids/hibs get a third stealther? When do albs/hibs get dmg reflect like shaman? The list goes on and on. Again, John from BS heard the complaints and clearly said it was by design.
    Post edited by RonELuvv on
  • Guess I’m just used to the new homogenized DAOC, back in the day everything was so different. I quit for 10+ years and came back to roughly most abilities being spread equally throughout realms
  • edited November 2018 PM
    I'm only going to say it once more. @Muylae give me PROOF that your savage is unplayable with a "73" weapon skill loss from 50 h2h to 43 h2h.

    You are so tunnel visioned it's unbelievable. You claim your horrendous WS makes it "impossible" for you to attack heavy tanks, well DUH, that's because we spec shield/parry MoBlocking and MoParry. We're supposed to be difficult to hit.

    Yet I don't see you stating how incredibly difficult it is for other melee DPS classes to land more than a single style against your savage with your defensive buffs up. Shoot most of the time the only DPS I can pump out into a savage is after I manage to get a slam because every other attack is parried or evaded.

    I'm tired of your opinionated paper DAoC complaints. You have an incredibly loud bark with absolutely nothing to back it up. The patch was JUST released and you claim during one single BG event you didn't see ANY savages using climb walls. If everything in this game was patched based on your personal opinion the servers would've been shut down ages ago.

    Spec for 50 savagery, 43h2h/2h and run in a group/zerg. Compile dps data of your damage output throughout. Guess what honey, you're going to see a slight reduction in damage and hit% because your dropping your h2h specline to obtain climb walls, DUH.

    You're essentially spewing out claims that 50 savagery 43 h2h/2h is absolutely worthless... Really? because you lost your side stun? You still have 43 spec points into your weapon line! My goodness you come across asking for Merc/BM/Zerk weapon skill while still being able to obtain your "optimal" spec and still want climb walls... Man some people.
    Post edited by Amp_Phetamine on
  • RonELuvv wrote: »
    @BurkleyRIP - We have been over this before. Just becuase one realm has something doesn't mean all 3 should have it the same way. DAoC doesn't mirror classes. All realms are unique. Saying vamps don't have to spec for it, and minstrils don't have to sacrifice as much to get it is not a defense. When you go down that road it's a slippery slope. When do hibs/albs get aoe stun? When do albs and mids get insta amnesia? When do mids/hibs get a third stealther? When do albs/hibs get dmg reflect like shaman? The list goes on and on. Again, John from BS heard the complaints and clearly said it was by design.

    and john is always right about everything ...
    Stor Hurfru Muylasav, wildly swinging arms around. Vicomte Muylock, calling curses on enemies. Lord Muylaetrix, calling upon winter storms. some other chars with names starting with Muyl.
  • Right or wrong, he heard your complaints and said it was as intended @Muylae. Stating the same issues over and over again won't change that.
  • BurkleyRIP wrote: »
    Guess I’m just used to the new homogenized DAOC, back in the day everything was so different. I quit for 10+ years and came back to roughly most abilities being spread equally throughout realms

    Alb got Celerity. Everything else that Alb had that was an advantage was handed to both other realms except Bolt Range mez, or nerfed into the ground and diluted. Skalds got a PBAE confuse just in case AOE Stun, 2.5s cast Confuse, PBAE fear, Instant PBAE chambers and AOE out the ass wasn't good enough for dealing with Theurg pets. Needed a 750 radius pet delete button for people who are too braindead to stop a caster from casting for 40 seconds straight.

    But Alb at least has Heretics, lol.

    Minstrel. Thane, Druid
    Heretic, BD, Animist
    Mauler
  • alb isn’t the only realm, plenty of stuff was homogenized. Ra’s, abilities, etc.
  • Neither of the other realms have the paladin AF buff, id love an af buff on my mid toons to put me over 1k :smile:
  • edited November 2018 PM
    Whyane wrote: »
    Neither of the other realms have the paladin AF buff, id love an af buff on my mid toons to put me over 1k :smile:

    Chanters got a 300 delve group AF buff that lasts 30 seconds and has 4000 range. It requires a spec of 16 in Enchantments.

    The Paladin is 127 delve and has 500 range at level 48.

    SMs also have a 25 stacking group AF for free, and it's 20m. Not amazing but still nice.
    Post edited by Ylazul on
    Minstrel. Thane, Druid
    Heretic, BD, Animist
    Mauler
  • Hi...just breezing by and cared to add in my opinion. I mostly solo and love the fact that savages got climb walls.It creates an additional method to play and makes it more entertaining but I believe there is a misconception about Climb wall for Savages in the sense that only savages who group and zerg are the only ones that would actually use it. Currently I am 49 Sav and 44 h2h rest parry spec. It's worked for me in the solo game and I dont usually respec when grouping either. When I mentioned that there is a misconception about CW for savages is because everyone in this thread is saying that savages would rip regardless of side stun or not, that is not necessarily the case. In a zerg, sidestun doesnt really matter as much as small man and solo playstyle so it's easy to say just sacrifice the side stun. As Armaggeden said, they usually run from you during keep seiges and you can easily get the backstyle off but as templates run nowadays, with heal procs and such, solo fights have become longer and toons can withstand much more damage. That being said, to spec for CW, as it is now, is viable for zerg/group but not as much for solo, unless you want to lose the stun. I will try the CW spec and see how it goes. But the fact remains that as a savage solo vs a decent soloer or multiples(usually the case), not having sidestun definitley decreases chances of survival or at least being a threat at all. As for those who said that they should sacrifice something, I agree. Nothing should come free, and I hardly see anything else that would be considered a sacrifice from a savage, coming from a spec of 49 savagery and 44h2h. Those who spec 50 h2h will have a different opinion. But, there have been lots of additions to other classes with no sacrifice, so why should a savage be the exception to that? Others mentioned that they have stealth lore and it would be too OP for a savage with SL to keep it's sidestun CHAIN, vamps also do have SL, and correct me if im mistaken, but vamps have climb walls as well and when played well, a vamp can't really lose to much solo. But I am an advocate of realm balance being a difference in what is similar rather than the same of each. Changes will always feel as if catered to a certain playstyle, but the reality is that one can choose to play that playstyle or not. That being said, I would like for CW to be available for all savage playstyles (Solo/smallman/group/zerg), and in my defense, keeps have been given extra doors, which are way too strong for a solo savage to beat down (oil doors) meaning more escape room for those who get targeted by a savage inside a keep.
  • edited November 2018 PM
    Probably better to nerf Vamp CW than add too much more to Savage. The Savage didn't get CW because the class needed it, but because Midgard campaigned for it (with no real justification, mind you). Savages and Vamps put out much more damage than Minstrels on the ramparts and can hang in a fight much longer, and that's generally what keeps people off of them.
    Post edited by Ylazul on
    Minstrel. Thane, Druid
    Heretic, BD, Animist
    Mauler
  • Ylazul wrote: »
    Probably better to nerf Vamp CW than add too much more to Savage. The Savage didn't get CW because the class needed it, but because Midgard campaigned for it (with no real justification, mind you). Savages and Vamps put out much more damage than Minstrels on the ramparts and can hang in a fight much longer, and that's generally what keeps people off of them.

    midgard needed a third CW class because we simple can't storm the walls in the way that albs and especially hibs do. BUT, giving it to savages at the ridiculous spec requirement felt like a slap in the face. for the realm, it would have been better to give it to zerks or skalds given the spec requirement for savage, provided that they (zerks or skalds) too would not be required to have to be forced to spec silly like requiring 50 weapon for skalds or 50 parry for zerks to get climb walls, ruining their specs.

    this whole things feels like a taunt, a cruel joke from BS. them saying 'hey, you got a third climb wall class, hahahahahahaha, now shut the **** up, hahahaha'
    Stor Hurfru Muylasav, wildly swinging arms around. Vicomte Muylock, calling curses on enemies. Lord Muylaetrix, calling upon winter storms. some other chars with names starting with Muyl.
  • It's mid bro, we always get the shitty half thought of crap
  • You are acting as though climb walls decides keep takes. It doesnt, and Mid already is the strongest realm class for class and in group/bg composition. Mid did not need a 3rd wall climber. Sav at 50 CW is perfect if you want that luxury.
    Minstrel. Thane, Druid
    Heretic, BD, Animist
    Mauler
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  • They have been jumping down muys throat for pages, resort to personal insult, which he never stoops to...every question people ask, he responds to. With numbers, not just opinions.

    Took long enough for someone to wrap them on the knuckles.
  • edited November 2018 PM
    Yes, a tick in the balance box for an additional climb class for Mid, so job done right?

    Would be interested to see how many savages (new, old or otherwise) actually respeced for this? In fact, if less than 10% of the savage population is actually bothering, maybe it points to poor implementation. I mean, compared to needing 25 stealth on a mini, which every mini would have, this is a bit different.
    Post edited by Auberne on
  • Ylazul wrote: »
    You are acting as though climb walls decides keep takes. It doesnt, and Mid already is the strongest realm class for class and in group/bg composition. Mid did not need a 3rd wall climber. Sav at 50 CW is perfect if you want that luxury.

    tell that to herorius who often has more people climbing over the wall than their are people defending.
    Stor Hurfru Muylasav, wildly swinging arms around. Vicomte Muylock, calling curses on enemies. Lord Muylaetrix, calling upon winter storms. some other chars with names starting with Muyl.
  • edited November 2018 PM
    Hi...just breezing by and cared to add in my opinion. I mostly solo and love the fact that savages got climb walls.It creates an additional method to play and makes it more entertaining but I believe there is a misconception about Climb wall for Savages in the sense that only savages who group and zerg are the only ones that would actually use it. Currently I am 49 Sav and 44 h2h rest parry spec. It's worked for me in the solo game and I dont usually respec when grouping either. When I mentioned that there is a misconception about CW for savages is because everyone in this thread is saying that savages would rip regardless of side stun or not, that is not necessarily the case. In a zerg, sidestun doesnt really matter as much as small man and solo playstyle so it's easy to say just sacrifice the side stun. As Armaggeden said, they usually run from you during keep seiges and you can easily get the backstyle off but as templates run nowadays, with heal procs and such, solo fights have become longer and toons can withstand much more damage. That being said, to spec for CW, as it is now, is viable for zerg/group but not as much for solo, unless you want to lose the stun. I will try the CW spec and see how it goes. But the fact remains that as a savage solo vs a decent soloer or multiples(usually the case), not having sidestun definitley decreases chances of survival or at least being a threat at all. As for those who said that they should sacrifice something, I agree. Nothing should come free, and I hardly see anything else that would be considered a sacrifice from a savage, coming from a spec of 49 savagery and 44h2h. Those who spec 50 h2h will have a different opinion. But, there have been lots of additions to other classes with no sacrifice, so why should a savage be the exception to that? Others mentioned that they have stealth lore and it would be too OP for a savage with SL to keep it's sidestun CHAIN, vamps also do have SL, and correct me if im mistaken, but vamps have climb walls as well and when played well, a vamp can't really lose to much solo. But I am an advocate of realm balance being a difference in what is similar rather than the same of each. Changes will always feel as if catered to a certain playstyle, but the reality is that one can choose to play that playstyle or not. That being said, I would like for CW to be available for all savage playstyles (Solo/smallman/group/zerg), and in my defense, keeps have been given extra doors, which are way too strong for a solo savage to beat down (oil doors) meaning more escape room for those who get targeted by a savage inside a keep.

    I think it's safe to assume that 43 weapon/50sav is for group/zerg spec anyways. After all, there typically is much different specs from soloing vs 8man vs zerg. Also, 2h speclines have evade chain stun, side stun (or back stun) with just 43 2h. So maybe 2h savages gain a little bit more being able to spec only 43 weapon and still get stuns other than 4s backstun from h2h.

    Might have to switch back to 2h and run with zerg for first time
    Post edited by Armagedden on
  • Muylae wrote: »
    tell that to herorius who often has more people climbing over the wall than their are people defending.

    True. Vamps are much more of a threat than Minstrels. Perhaps their Climb Walls should not be free.
    Minstrel. Thane, Druid
    Heretic, BD, Animist
    Mauler
  • For a Zerg savage, the side stun will most likely be useless as the Target was probably stun immune anyway. The side stun is awesome for small man and 8 vs 8 I would assume, since I don’t 8man, I’m just assuming. Wall climb even in the Zerg most nights will only get used every once in a while since the US prime bg doesn’t really hit keeps with any regularity.
  • BurkleyRIP wrote: »
    For a Zerg savage, the side stun will most likely be useless as the Target was probably stun immune anyway. The side stun is awesome for small man and 8 vs 8 I would assume, since I don’t 8man, I’m just assuming. Wall climb even in the Zerg most nights will only get used every once in a while since the US prime bg doesn’t really hit keeps with any regularity.

    Aye, I suspect 43 2h savages will be loving CW. If anyone feels that 2h savages aren't viable, I'd like to reference Stackbodies (troll savage) who can absolutely melt people as a 2h savage.
  • I’m sure 2 hand dmg is good with buffs up, but the styles are terrible
  • BurkleyRIP wrote: »
    I’m sure 2 hand dmg is good with buffs up, but the styles are terrible

    Yeah the styles could use some re-working for sure, maybe BS could polish up the savage 2h line and polearm/two-handed lines at the same time.
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