what is the reasoning behind the mezz increase duration ?
just wondering. please comment. because i don't get it.
Stor Hurfru Muylasav, wildly swinging arms around. Vicomte Muylock, calling curses on enemies. Baron Muylaetrex, Undead guy. Baronet Muylaetrix, calling upon winter storms. Baronet Facetothewallmuppet, support type standing with his face to the wall most of the time. Baronetess Yovonne, taxi. some other chars with names starting with Muyl.
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Does anyone ever sit a full duration mezz anymore?
Edit: would like to know how much longer it really adds, some one good at maths?
In case of bard, a 70 sec mez with lets say 26+16 resists (skald resist buff) would look like:
70->40,6->8,12 sec
With 7 extra seconds
77->44,66->8,932 sec
7 sec difference in this case is 0,82 sec effectively on a det tank. With better resists difference is even slimmer, but secondary resists do not affect mez duration.
This likely affect det tanks with stoicism the least.
Edit: Difference is 7 sec not 5, corrected.
The duration was only increased enough to ensure that stoic/det tanks had at least a 1s increase in duration when 350 radius from center of the new casted AoE mezzes. Which may not seem like a lot in absolute terms but is a significant increase (33%) from their existing live duration of ~3s at 350 radius away. Non stoic/det classes should see a ~6-7s increase on average (meaning with 35% resists against a +25% duration mezzer) which is obviously more in absolute terms but a smaller percentage increase.
In addition to the duration increases, the radius increases mean that more of a 'clump' will get mezzed initially and once mezzed, not be as easily cured with heavy tank cures, again reinforcing the goal of making initial mezzes "stick" more. It also means failure to really spread out will result in being more easily interrupted.
Overall, this change reinforces the need to re-position and spread-out in combat to be most effective and, along with the PBAoE damage increases, should give smaller, highly-coordinated forces a bit more of a fighting chance vs larger ones.
Det9+stoicism already are barely slowed down by an AOE mezz, now everyone else get aoe mezzed out much easier. (Less skill involved spamming AoE mezz).
GL
https://divoxutils.com/users/user_2ZTPHy8tjVF9LWMgujSZfCY9Mos/characters
This may help to alleviate some of the confusion and provide open communication to the f2p/EC players.
I can’t help but feel great concern about why the need to push “class balance” with the same exact patch as EC.
Most players want the DAOC they remember and played. It’s very confusing as an active subscriber to understand these “class balance changes”, now imagine if your’re a returning or new player?! @beibhinn
GL
https://divoxutils.com/users/user_2ZTPHy8tjVF9LWMgujSZfCY9Mos/characters
Class changes aren't primarily targeted at new/returning players. They are primarily targeted at the existing users who are more likely to understand the reasoning behind them and who are sending in the feedback requesting those very changes. New/Returning players will mostly be learning the game as it is post-release of 1.126 and will be adapting to how things *are* without much need to know how things were.
We've explained quite a lot of our reasoning here and on discord to the players that want to know why XYZ was changed as well as had two grab bags all about EC-restrictions/changes in addition to the EC FAQ, EC Features Table, and detailed 1.126 patch notes. With all of that information already confronting new and returning players, the last thing we want to do is overwhelm them with more herald posts that have technical and end-game focused reasoning for class changes when those changes won't even really be "changes" to them. Further, many of the class changes in this patch are essentially reversions to how things were, so there's a good chance that some things will be more familiar to many returning players than they would have been prior to 1.126.
With 1.126 we'll have some brand new guides and directions on the website for new/returning players. That's the sort of communication that will be beneficial to them as they get (back) into DAoC.
Where is the skill in spamming an 1875 base range 450 radius AE Mez for interrupts? Bolt range 450 Radius interrupts should not be implemented. Even if the mez is broken the interrupt potential is just too large of an impact in all forms of gameplay. @John_Broadsword
Sorcs have had a 50-unit radius advantage in addition to their bolt-range advantage because Healers and Bards have AoE insta-CC. We're keeping that same dynamic in place with these changes.
400 Radius interrupts are already incredibly strong and now you are increasing a 400 radius bolt range interrupt to a 450 radius one. This is what perplexes me is that you and your team are introducing such a powerful interrupt that far exceeds other realms and seem to be ok with it and from your post if I'm reading it correctly believe it is fair as long it is consistent with the other realms increase in radius. Albion is already the strongest pull/extend realm in the game and you are making them even stronger with this addition in radius.
If you wanted to combat det/stoicism tanks then why didn't you just leave mezzes alone and reduce stoicism down by 5 or 10% instead? Why imbalance the interrupt game even more than what it already is? @John_Broadsword
Well then. When should we expect to see old Hunter RR5 back? ;-)
These forums and the discord are utilized by a small percent of Daoc users.
For example on Midgard the largest “RVR alliance” only uses TS3 and actively discourages the use of Discord.
The Class balance reasoning is extremely confusing even to the most hardcore of active DAOC players. The ROI for open mass communication is worth the effort.
GL
https://divoxutils.com/users/user_2ZTPHy8tjVF9LWMgujSZfCY9Mos/characters
In your scenario of casual/BG laid-back gamestyle first mez isn't a big deal as it will be broken by ae damage trigger happy players. AE Mezzes then turn into interrupt wars. Who has the advantage here? Two classes with 1500 range 400 radius mez or one with an 1875 range 450 radius? If @John_Broadsword wants to increase duration well that's his decision but changing an already broken ranged interrupt to be even better that I can't agree with.
Oh, and if people don't read the forums, then I doubt they would read the front page of the Herald, either.
Edit: @Daelin
I'm gonna say the group that can get a ES bainshee and a creep ani?
"The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
"Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
Kind of what I tried to say. If people gonna get caught being on stick half afk, they most likely never notice any change in mess, since not everyone (probably majority) reads all patch notes, crawl on forums.
to give groups a better chance when being outnumbered by mindless drones
@Daelin care to enlighten us with another scenario?
@Snaillyn We can sit here and paper DAoC all day long. Any NS push could be countered by a NS spam on the NS'er or any spell with a 2300 range or similar to what you mentioned, "many other factors" to freeing up the sorc to resume spamming and rotating of cc. Also about your insta-amnesia with a range greater than 2300 that would require a bard and VW with their 10% range increase as bards insta amnesia is base 2k range. I'm not saying people don't run VW'ers as they are a great caster group addition with their range and 10% loyalty cloak magic damage /use, Battlemaster, and access to Bedazzling Aura and Ichor but that is paper DAoC. The more players you add into the scenarios the greater the 1875 base range 450 radius impacts enemies. For 8v8 very little will possibly change with the mez duration and radius changes but in large scale fights or keep/choke point fights, it will have a very large impact.
@Shoke you stated "I'm gonna say the group that can get a ES bainshee and a creep ani?" It's rare for an 8v8 group to take an ES Bainshee as other classes can fit into a group better. Large scale fights are where ES bainshees are mostly present. ES Bains are strong in large scale fights but their AE nearsight has a couple drawbacks. Their AE Nearsight is a focus pulse spell meaning that they are required to be standing still focusing on their target which doesn't prevent the target from extending and getting out of range or in between pulses they can be amnesia spammed preventing the pulse from working. I can't tell you how many times I've AE nearsighted on my ES Bain and in between pulses been amnesia spammed stopping me from pulsing forcing me to reposition and cast my 2300 range taunt hoping to interrupt their amnesia spam.
We can all sit here and Paper DAoC all day long but at the end of the day an increase to Sorcs level 44 AE Mes from 400 radius to 450 is not good for the game in my opinion. I don't believe bards and healers should have a radius increase either. As with all changes made by Broadsword people will adapt or leave. Only time will tell.
Fairly certain we all know the answer to the last sentence...
Again WHY are "they" re-pushing "class balance", when the entire focus of the patch should be launching EC flawlessly onto live w/minimal amount of bugs or issues.
https://divoxutils.com/users/user_2ZTPHy8tjVF9LWMgujSZfCY9Mos/characters
i appreciate that you explain your reasoning. i really do. i just don't agree with your reasoning. that probably means little or nothing to you. you have a record of listening to the wrong people when it comes to for what's good for the game. and i think, that ones more, you make the same mistake. what's good for the game is not what's good for some elite group. what's good for some elite groups will kill the game in the end, imho, if you tailor the game towards them.
if you want to have the free to play players <noobs> (lol) to have any chance of staying in the game, for the sake of longevity of the game, which certainly everyone wants, then a lot of the things you propose don't make sense to me.
will the change in CC allow a bomb group a slightly better chance to do damage to a BG (yes, i'v been involved in fg vs herorius bombing) ? yes, maybe. but it think the main advantage will be to elite roaming groups fighting inferior groups.
Interesting, so when do you plan on tweaking the radius/duration on the minstrel mezz?
If your gonna give linger duration and aoe range to every other cc toon in game reducing the aoe cast speed on the minstrel ain’t to much to ask
also the visual spell effect on ministrel needs to be reduced, can see this cast from narnia
"The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
"Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
Also can you revert back the nerf to minstrel mezz duration? That would be stellar, and falls in line with “class balance” patch that’s reverting changes from the past.
GL
https://divoxutils.com/users/user_2ZTPHy8tjVF9LWMgujSZfCY9Mos/characters
The standard reason was it will make stealth groups overpowered but to be honest with the mez poison access to purge and all the other crap stealthers get these days reducing the minstrel aoe cast time by a couple of seconds really isn’t much of a big deal.
The usual well minstrel have Access to all this frontline stuff and can cast on the move is also irrelevant the same argument can be made for healers bards and skalds.
Big changes were made in the game to other cc classes which changed game balance dramatically.A lot of the time on alb a minstrel will be your only cc flute mez is nice but it would be nice to be able to use your aoe mez at the moment there is no point having it trying to get a 5 sec cast off in a fight kinda makes it redundant.
The other thing u would like on minstrels is some indication of when your flute mez is still active an icon or something because it can mess up other actions with out you knowing it.
speed or other functions.
I’m not talking about the mez effect on the toon u are mezzing I’m talking about something in the ui.
I care for casual gamestyle, but more population, the bigger BGs will get, which is a hidden "boost" of that playstyle. I guess thats what BS expects behind these very small changes to help lesser people fight against more. It's actually going to be better for defenders with lesser numbers (see PB changes), which also helps casual gamestyle.
The UI I have has an active chant box so you can see what is running. Maybe BS could put that option in their base UI.
Concentration window.Edit: Duh, already mentioned.
As for the CC in the game, we really want to increase it? I read the notes and frankly, I'm surprised. Who is needing a longer CC? Forget the range right now, or the extension of the 50 units, you need more time? This brings me to the next statement.
Brut is correct, and many times it's mentioned, but often it's working as intended.
The field on CC is not equal in any stance. Honestly I'm not for increasing the CC duration at all, if anything I think it should be shortened greatly. I see this mez increase honestly trying to cater to a very few people that are worried about 8v8. Don't get me wrong, I'm for all play styles, one on one, 8v8, or BG, making this change for a few, that will effect so many more, I just don't see the reason here. Just putting in my thoughts.
I don't think there needs to be any changes to CC, especially since the inside of towers are about 495-500 units. @John_Broadsword if spell range effects spell radius, you will have Sorcerer's locking down entire floors of towers with MoC5, especially with the radius decrease to power leak.
100% agree. So why should we change our game mechanics for those that cannot do this properly? Long gone are the days of 8mans kiting zergs across islands, and those zergs were much bigger.
Whats the difference between aoe hammers/heretic aoe/aoe dots/aoe disease, aoe roots.
All of these abilities on various classes have similar radius, similar range and essentially "interupt" in exactly teh same way.
bards and healer have been pushing and moc mezzing for 15 years with phaseshift/rr5 as a get out of jail free card.