Friday Grab Bag - Endless Conquest Edition
Welcome to this week's Grab Bag! This Grab Bag is focused on answering some of the recurring and top questions we've been asked regarding our recent Endless Conquest announcement.
Thanks to everyone for sending in these questions, and remember to please keep sending in your general grab bag questions for our devs! You can submit any game related questions you have for our DAoC Devs through our Grab Bag submission form. Please note this is for game mechanic questions. Feedback/ideas/suggestions should be sent in through our feedback form.
On to the questions!
I'm not sure I fully understand what this is all about. Can you give a quick summary of what Endless Conquest is?
Will accounts get any special treatment for being previously subbed for a long period of time and attaining the elder title? I feel like some special perk should be given to those who subbed for a long time before EC.
Will we be able to post on the Official Forums if we have only have an active EC account?
How will EC work regarding multiple accounts/multiboxing? Can I run a macro-team?
Quick question about EC and Battlegrounds. Will existing characters that already have xp/rp off automatically have them turned on if it is not a subscribed(veteran?) account?
How were the classes that EC players have available to them chosen, and for what reasons? Will the available classes ever rotate or be expanded upon?
There's already been some excitement in region about EC coming live with new people popping in to the chat to possibly check things out. If an account was recently inactive for 180 days does that still count, or does it need to remain inactive until EC starts for this to work?
If I subscribe, make a non-EC class like a Bonedancer, then end my subscription at a later date, do I have to wait the 180 days before EC kicks in to play DAoC as a free player? Once the 180 day period ends, can I play my Bonedancer?
From the EC FAQ: Returning EC account characters that have already trained Realm abilities will have those abilities automatically respecced and their realm skill points refunded on first login; any existing Champion abilities will be automatically removed too.
Regarding this... what happens if you upgrade your account to a Veteran account? Do the CL abilities and Realm skill points get restored?
When does the realm timer countdown start? From log out or last RP gained? Why 15 minutes and not 30?
Are there any class or RvR changes planned to go in with EC?
Choc full of info!
That's it for this week, have a good weekend all
See you in the frontiers!
Click here to visit the DAoC Herald!
Thanks to everyone for sending in these questions, and remember to please keep sending in your general grab bag questions for our devs! You can submit any game related questions you have for our DAoC Devs through our Grab Bag submission form. Please note this is for game mechanic questions. Feedback/ideas/suggestions should be sent in through our feedback form.
On to the questions!
I'm not sure I fully understand what this is all about. Can you give a quick summary of what Endless Conquest is?
Sure thing!
Currently Dark Age of Camelot is a subscription-only game where accounts must subscribe monthly in order to access the game and its features. Endless Conquest will be a new account type that does not require a subscription to access Dark Age of Camelot and allows EC-enabled accounts to explore the realms, participate in our fabled RvR combat and generally play for free, albeit with some gameplay-restrictions like certain classes, buffs, and more.
With the launch of Endless Conquest, players will have a choice to play on an EC-enabled account (no subscription) or a Veteran (subscribed) account. Veteran accounts will have access to several rewards and events that EC accounts won't and generally have unrestricted access to all gameplay features, classes, and more. Our announcement earlier this week goes through those restrictions and privileges in detail.
Currently Dark Age of Camelot is a subscription-only game where accounts must subscribe monthly in order to access the game and its features. Endless Conquest will be a new account type that does not require a subscription to access Dark Age of Camelot and allows EC-enabled accounts to explore the realms, participate in our fabled RvR combat and generally play for free, albeit with some gameplay-restrictions like certain classes, buffs, and more.
With the launch of Endless Conquest, players will have a choice to play on an EC-enabled account (no subscription) or a Veteran (subscribed) account. Veteran accounts will have access to several rewards and events that EC accounts won't and generally have unrestricted access to all gameplay features, classes, and more. Our announcement earlier this week goes through those restrictions and privileges in detail.
Will accounts get any special treatment for being previously subbed for a long period of time and attaining the elder title? I feel like some special perk should be given to those who subbed for a long time before EC.
We absolutely agree! Subscribed accounts will receive a choice of at least 1 Veteran Reward at each of the 11 planned cumulative subscription thresholds. The Veteran Reward can be redeemed once per account and some of them can be traded to other characters (though they won’t be usable by an EC account).
The full details of this system will have to wait until the Patch 1.126 notes but we can promise they’ll be coveted rewards and the longer you’ve subscribed, the more coveted they’ll become!
Additionally, subscriptions will get a bonus quest every month that gives a meaningful reward to every level 50 character on their account.
The full details of this system will have to wait until the Patch 1.126 notes but we can promise they’ll be coveted rewards and the longer you’ve subscribed, the more coveted they’ll become!
Additionally, subscriptions will get a bonus quest every month that gives a meaningful reward to every level 50 character on their account.
Will we be able to post on the Official Forums if we have only have an active EC account?
Yes! Users with active game accounts can post on our Official Forums. We currently are not planning on any forum-specific restrictions on EC-enabled accounts, but that could change if necessary.
How will EC work regarding multiple accounts/multiboxing? Can I run a macro-team?
No, Endless Conquest accounts are not permitted to multibox/macro-group in PvE or RvR. Further, one Endless Conquest account is able to be logged in per user at a time.
If that restriction is somehow circumvented, any EC accounts that are being operated with 3rd party multibox/macro-team programs will be actioned on a much shorter leash than for Veteran accounts. This can include the revocation of that account’s eligibility for Endless Conquest or simply termination of the account for even first or second offenses, depending on the severity.
The same can be said for any violations found on EC accounts.
If that restriction is somehow circumvented, any EC accounts that are being operated with 3rd party multibox/macro-team programs will be actioned on a much shorter leash than for Veteran accounts. This can include the revocation of that account’s eligibility for Endless Conquest or simply termination of the account for even first or second offenses, depending on the severity.
The same can be said for any violations found on EC accounts.
Quick question about EC and Battlegrounds. Will existing characters that already have xp/rp off automatically have them turned on if it is not a subscribed(veteran?) account?
Yes. /xp off and /rp off commands will not be usable and any returning EC account with them already enabled will have them disabled upon login.
Additionally, characters will no longer lose experience on PvE deaths and EC accounts will be prohibited from using the Realm Point Remover NPC. EC accounts will be able to visit the Mithril store and have the option of purchasing temporary buffs that cease XP/RP gain for their duration if they want to stick around a particular battleground a bit longer.
Additionally, characters will no longer lose experience on PvE deaths and EC accounts will be prohibited from using the Realm Point Remover NPC. EC accounts will be able to visit the Mithril store and have the option of purchasing temporary buffs that cease XP/RP gain for their duration if they want to stick around a particular battleground a bit longer.
How were the classes that EC players have available to them chosen, and for what reasons? Will the available classes ever rotate or be expanded upon?
With the five chosen classes, EC accounts have access to their realm’s primary, secondary, and tertiary healing, primary buffing and crowd-control, and a maximum realm speed class, along with a ranged and melee DPS class.
As any experienced player knows, those aspects are extremely valuable to have in RvR groups. We want to encourage the ability for EC accounts to be invited to groups and to be able to add to the experience of their fellow players. By choosing classes that would be sought after in RvR, we aim to have EC accounts add value to the existing Veteran accounts who just need that 1 more support or crowd control class.
On the flip side, the chosen classes are not necessarily the greatest or most popular in PvE encounters, which limits their self-sufficiency there, and there are certainly some fun and awesome classes and races that EC accounts miss out on. As such, we’re quite happy with the balance struck. We do not have plans for expanding which ones are offered beyond the five and will not be rotating them with other classes.
As any experienced player knows, those aspects are extremely valuable to have in RvR groups. We want to encourage the ability for EC accounts to be invited to groups and to be able to add to the experience of their fellow players. By choosing classes that would be sought after in RvR, we aim to have EC accounts add value to the existing Veteran accounts who just need that 1 more support or crowd control class.
On the flip side, the chosen classes are not necessarily the greatest or most popular in PvE encounters, which limits their self-sufficiency there, and there are certainly some fun and awesome classes and races that EC accounts miss out on. As such, we’re quite happy with the balance struck. We do not have plans for expanding which ones are offered beyond the five and will not be rotating them with other classes.
There's already been some excitement in region about EC coming live with new people popping in to the chat to possibly check things out. If an account was recently inactive for 180 days does that still count, or does it need to remain inactive until EC starts for this to work?
Unfortunately we have to draw the line somewhere.
Only previously-subscribed, 180 day+ inactive accounts, in good-standing, or newly created accounts will be eligible as Endless Conquest accounts. Any account that is currently subscribed or was subscribed less than 180 days ago (starting from the launch day of EC), will not be eligible for EC. We feel very strongly that EC will be adding to the value of our current and future Veteran accounts but if a user wishes to or circumstances dictate that an account be deactivated, it will only become eligible for EC again after 180 days of inactivity.
Endless Conquest is about giving players an opportunity to try and play Dark Age of Camelot for free as first timers or to return and rediscover their love for their realm and characters, all while still able to contribute towards the end-game in a meaningful way. Without that ability to contribute, we don’t think Endless Conquest would be worth it. We strongly feel that the more players playing DAoC, the better the experience is. Veteran accounts will especially benefit with more people in the game RvRing, PvEing, and socializing, making the value of a subscription increase that much more!
Only previously-subscribed, 180 day+ inactive accounts, in good-standing, or newly created accounts will be eligible as Endless Conquest accounts. Any account that is currently subscribed or was subscribed less than 180 days ago (starting from the launch day of EC), will not be eligible for EC. We feel very strongly that EC will be adding to the value of our current and future Veteran accounts but if a user wishes to or circumstances dictate that an account be deactivated, it will only become eligible for EC again after 180 days of inactivity.
Endless Conquest is about giving players an opportunity to try and play Dark Age of Camelot for free as first timers or to return and rediscover their love for their realm and characters, all while still able to contribute towards the end-game in a meaningful way. Without that ability to contribute, we don’t think Endless Conquest would be worth it. We strongly feel that the more players playing DAoC, the better the experience is. Veteran accounts will especially benefit with more people in the game RvRing, PvEing, and socializing, making the value of a subscription increase that much more!
If I subscribe, make a non-EC class like a Bonedancer, then end my subscription at a later date, do I have to wait the 180 days before EC kicks in to play DAoC as a free player? Once the 180 day period ends, can I play my Bonedancer?
Yes, if an account’s subscription lapses, it only activates Endless Conquest after 180 days of inactivity, regardless of the classes on it.
Once the 180 period has passed and it becomes an EC account, the Bonedancer will only be playable if it has 7+ days on their /played stat, is above level 15, and was created *before* the initial launch of EC. Otherwise, the account will only be able to play or create the EC-enabled classes.
Once the 180 period has passed and it becomes an EC account, the Bonedancer will only be playable if it has 7+ days on their /played stat, is above level 15, and was created *before* the initial launch of EC. Otherwise, the account will only be able to play or create the EC-enabled classes.
From the EC FAQ: Returning EC account characters that have already trained Realm abilities will have those abilities automatically respecced and their realm skill points refunded on first login; any existing Champion abilities will be automatically removed too.
Regarding this... what happens if you upgrade your account to a Veteran account? Do the CL abilities and Realm skill points get restored?
Yes, any account that upgrades from EC to Veteran will have their applicable Champion Ability points restored (if the character has CLs completed) and will be able to spend above the 60 realm skill point threshold. Characters on upgraded accounts will also have any trained realm abilities automatically respecced to ensure they have the full availability of realm skill points.
This is also a good opportunity to clarify that accounts who upgrade from EC to Veteran will need to fully log out their game client before the Veteran (subscribed) status benefits will apply.
This is also a good opportunity to clarify that accounts who upgrade from EC to Veteran will need to fully log out their game client before the Veteran (subscribed) status benefits will apply.
When does the realm timer countdown start? From log out or last RP gained? Why 15 minutes and not 30?
The timer starts when realm points are gained from an RvR kill, not logout. We have gone back and forth between 30 and 15 minutes quite a bit and it may be that something in between ends up being the sweet-spot, but we want to start out on the low-end and increase from there if it’s still not long enough; rather than the reverse.
Are there any class or RvR changes planned to go in with EC?
Yes, some! We are mostly focusing on Endless Conquest with patch 1.126 but we have some impactful RvR and some much-requested class changes on the way too. No hints though!
Okay, fine.
For RvR, we’ll be performing some fairly-involved progression changes within the Battlegrounds to help give all players a chance to once again spend some quality RvR time there, as well as taking another look at Frontier daily rewards and RvR bonuses, along with spreading some Bounty Point love to non-RvR areas. Is the ‘Supplies for the Cause’ quest going back to fully repeatable!? /wink. For classes, we still feel a few are over-performing in certain areas and some need a little love too. Oh you wanted to know which ones? Not yet, friend!
Okay, fine.
For RvR, we’ll be performing some fairly-involved progression changes within the Battlegrounds to help give all players a chance to once again spend some quality RvR time there, as well as taking another look at Frontier daily rewards and RvR bonuses, along with spreading some Bounty Point love to non-RvR areas. Is the ‘Supplies for the Cause’ quest going back to fully repeatable!? /wink. For classes, we still feel a few are over-performing in certain areas and some need a little love too. Oh you wanted to know which ones? Not yet, friend!
Choc full of info!
That's it for this week, have a good weekend all
See you in the frontiers!
Click here to visit the DAoC Herald!
Post edited by Carol_Broadsword on
DAoC Community Lead
Broadsword Online Games
Broadsword Online Games
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I'll continue subbed with premium accounts to support the game I love.
nice
Does this imply that if you circumvent the 1 EC account per player restriction, but you don't use multibox/macro software, then it's fine to PvE with more than one EC account logged in? Since it only mentions action if you use 3rd party tools.
I don't run macro teams myself, but when I pve I sometimes utilize more than one account and just alt-tab between them. Is that still allowed if I would like to do that with multiple EC accounts involved?
YouTube
That said, we're not planning on going out and policing against every normal-playing EC buffbot + dps duo we see. If it becomes a problem, we may have to clamp down though.
EC accounts that abuse their free access to the game in a way that exploits the game/its economy/detracts from other players' enjoyment or is generally playing against the spirit of the game, regardless of how many accounts they are logging in, won't have that privilege for long (at a minimum).
ok..thanks John, I was over thinking it. I don't mind paying. This greatest game ever.
Don't forget you also would, as a subbed account, get additional access you don't have currently to an extra weekly quest (not sure) and some tiered gear rewards based on account length subbed. Personally I'm hoping for things like Pendragon's Bracer or other not-over the top but you'd definitely try to fit it in if you had one items.
The EC plan is a positive one and will hopefully translate to a renewed interest in the game. There are other aspects that could also contribute to this, such as proactive anti-cheating measures and a commitment to a realm timer that reflects the majority of the player base's wishes.
Noting above comment re EC accts. abusing free access .. , this part:
"...generally playing against the spirit of the game..." struck me. Regarding realm timers, the lack thereof, and the recently stated plan of a 15min. timer, it could be argued that the wanton realm hopping prevalent today is against the spirit of the game. IMO reinstating a timer will do much to uphold that Spirit, and will signal to those players that may have quit Live due to a perceived lack of that Spirit being upheld that some positive changes are in the works. Do not underestimate that ol' original Spirit of DAoC isn't a sizeable part of the nostalgia that compels a returning player to resub, and yes, having a timer is a part of that for many*.
As for the player's wishes, ofc that's a tricky one generally. They'll always be that rabidly vocal minority (Hi "IRCers"). However there was recently (IIRC) a poll posted here on a Realm Timer with either an option for a "none" or various timer lengths. Is it still up? Which option won? Is the recently stated plan of a 15min. timer a result of that poll that directly queried the players that participated ?
Maybe we can settle this once and for all and have you or another rep. from Broadsword post a new timer poll, I suggest these options: None, 15min., 30min, 1hour. After a period of time, post and implement the majority opinion, based on our wishes. There could also be followup polls. Let the majority of the player base decide this issue. It would be a "good look" and good looks can be a critical part on recovering our population.
*In the last few weeks our guild has invited several returning players that were away from the game anywhere from 3 to 15years, mentioning the EC plan or nostalgia as factors of their return. Coincidentally they all support a reinstatement of a realm timer.
Founder/GM of Ásatrúar, guild of Miðgarðr
In defense of the Original Spirit of Daoc
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True to Miðgarðr c.2001
daocutils.com/chimp/jlfrthjo
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On Ywain however all three realms have been freely accessible on the same server since its inception, and there are no other servers. One could argue here that it is encouraged, or at least not discouraged, that players take the opportunity to explore all three realms given the lack of alternative servers to do so on. You could argue that a new "spirit" was born at this point and that it'd be against this new spirit to insist that players restrict themselves to a singular realm given the freedom they now have to explore all three.
Many of the singular realm loyalists won't be satisfied no matter what the timer ends up being since for all they care it could be 365 days and it still wouldn't affect them and they don't consider the disastrous effects this would have on the server, which is also why a majority vote may not be the smartest idea. Meanwhile during the arguments taking place in half a dozen threads or so it has become clear that anything over 15 minutes will make people leave the game unless action dramatically improves with EC (we'll soon find out!). Now with that in mind, how many do you expect are returning to the game purely because of the realm timers? I must still insist on it being wiser to remove timers altogether from veteran accounts, makes it a stronger incentive to pay a sub at the very least, but I will give the 15 minute timers a chance and see how it works out.
IMO if you want to envelop yourself in that old spirit on a server where you have been able to make characters on all three realms from the start it is up to YOU to gather likeminded individuals and uphold this tradition amongst yourselves. It is no longer a mindset that can be expected to be upheld by the entire server and it should not be forcefully made to do so on behalf of the players that will suffer for it; the game has moved on. If a new server gets released you can have permanent realm timers there no problem but not on the only server we have left where many have commited their love to all three of the realms.
tl;dr the above is a rebuttal against the concept of realm pride on ywain in 2k19 and does not think it is wise to force this upon the population.
YouTube
a balance,, for those who would like to taste the other realms...............
also for the realm hoppers looking for action no rps if they switch to a higher populated realm--i know that would be hard to do lol.
That said your entire argument is based on population preservation, but you fail to account for how some current play-styles may have put us in this situation of low population. If it were as simple as Rescu is running his nightly zerg you hop over to mid or hib and fight him. And then later in the night, mids have numbers so you jump over to hibs or albs for good fights then, while I don't prefer it, I get it.
However what you do not account for completely parasitic/opportunistic realm-hopping play-styles and how they hurt our population. For example a "group" of 'highly organized players with alts in all realms and very recognizable names' jumping into a BG to fight a zerg for multiple hits. Then the minute they finish daily quests they insist that the BG takes KM, and where are they? Running behind the rink to log out and relog to their toons on the realm holding KM to farm the BG they were just in. Those aren't people exploring other realms, or looking for the good fight, they are parasitic trolls griefing other players for personal gain -- not the good of the server. Now, will a 15 minute realm timer help this issue? Sure, 15 minutes later (as compared to 2) the BG won't be on KM anymore and will have taken it or left. Problem solved.
But, what will a 15 minute realm timer not solve - simply put... Relics
And before you say relics do not matter I am going to simply say "Bull!"
In an era of min/max templates 10% dmg. per a relic is the same as capped ToA bonuses. To use current events, the biggest running joke late at night when content dries up is "Scaith!" Why Scaith? Because flaming Scaith or putting up a Seige tower the fastest way to take HIbs from a population bonus of +70% to flat to your realm having a +20%. I guess some of these could be people legit logging on because of notification via 3rd party apps. But the majority of these folks just hopped realms. All the sudden you are being farmed for siege kills by those "'highly organized players with alts in all realms and very recognizable names" who were just logged into your realm 5 minutes ago. These are not people "looking for the good fight or to defend the realm" they are realm hopping parasites just looking to farm RPs and a 15 minute realm timer will do nothing to prevent it due to the door HP of the relic gate keeps.
Frankly speaking it really shouldn't be both ways:
1) either the realm timer needs to be long enough that those people who want a flavor of "realm pride" or "old school DAoC", at least in some ways, can play the game as it was built (which IS the reason I reactivated - and yes open field RvR is part of that too)
OR
2) I suppose we can acknowledge that your "new spirit of the game" is here to stay and the "realm pride" is out-dated since New Frontiers are now essentially just a PvP arena without larger goals. And if that is the case the BS should literally just remove relics from the game and make it so realms can talk to each other similar to how Mordred was structured. Since this seems to be the "New Spirit" you speak of see how many people hang around...I think the current population declines speak for themselves.
To sum it very plainly and clearly - I DO NOT CARE if people play all the realms - please do! There are great reasons to play all three realms which help the game and help population build or remain stable. A realm switch timer LONG enough to complete discrete goals (taking a keep/taking a relic) is important to prevent parasitic/self-serving behavior which isn't about good fights, it is essentially cross realm griefing which is in itself killing server population and driving off returning players.
TL/DR -- It isn't that people play other realms, it is how they go about doing it and realm timers long enough for people to accomplish goals without having you go from beside them to nuking them in the process prevent you from realm switching in a way detrimental to the game.
GW2 has a good system in this regard but doesn't have the mechanics for PvP / RvR like DAoC does.
"The type of of dev communication of 30 mins a day updates mentioned here just isn't feasible." - Carol_Broadsword
"Our Studio. Our Rules." - http://www.mythicentertainment.com/
@John_Broadsword
There is another pb with these restrictions.
Veteran accounts that become EC accounts can have multiple "mule" characters. These characters will not have 7 days of play for the most part.
With all non-tradable items and all other items kept, all veteran players use "mules". It's almost indispensable.
Could you allow all characters in an EC account to log in but only in one area. For exemple housing (entrance) or capitals ? [/quote]
No, the 7 days /played restriction is in-place at least partly because of this. If you want access to everything, you should consider subscribing
2001 we had msn messenger?irc? VN boards and ICQ - todays landscape is totally different to the point alarm clock raids are a thing of the past. Discord, Whatsapp and all the other real time chat, and outside communities allow us to react, relog, login on a dime - port instantly and directly to where we want to be and log out / relog until the next round.
I can't see how Broadsword can fix the playerbases mentality and playerstyle based on all the information avaliable ingame (spam/stat/target etc) and outside of the game(discord/whatsapp etc)- particually when there is so many opinions what will and wont work as you see in this short thread alone.
Playerbase needs to step up and nuture, not abuse and play in the spirit of the game - even if it means /releasing now and then.
log to pendragon
It's RvR, not PvP. In Mythic's own words, Red is Dead. This is the basic guideline, everything else grew organically and is made up by players, not in the original spirit of the game.
Like last night I was kiting and fighting a necro and a savage "added" while I was resetting the fight. It's realm versus
realm so it's okay to help each other, especially against an OP class such as necro. I welcomed what I thought was a fellow Midgardian trying to help a realm mate. Well, when I started plinking the necro again, the savage, Gamboa, just backed off and the Necro re-engaged me. I did pretty well for most of it and lasted longer than I expected but when I got to 50%, suddenly the necro used something and I went from 50% to 0. According to Mythic's rules we should both have been on the necro and by just standing there, the savage was crossrealming. And it's true.
But it's also what has grown organically through the years, it is what it is and decisions are made on the spot. You have to know your team mates and understand that some of them are not team mates at all, and get to know as many players as possible so you don't misunderstand their intentions.
Know your friends, know your enemies, know your frenemies.
and I don't know who (may be employees?) asked the questions; but I found both them and the answers worth reading - doesn't happen often. also, thanks for the arithmetic on the https://forum.darkageofcamelot.com/discussion/2697/friday-grab-bag-10-18-2019 was good to know.